On Feb 1, 2022, at 11:26, Joseph DiVerdi <joseph.diverdi**At_Symbol_Here**COLOSTATE.EDU> wrote:

Interesting thread and discussion.

I see a parade of undergraduate (UG) chemistry majors every year. I also see a parade of individuals who: (1) are increasingly less familiar with (what to call it) "bench-top" chemistry, descriptive chemistry and such and (2) are increasingly afraid of handling and using "chemicals." A healthy "fear" is appropriate however what I see goes beyond this. They are increasingly less comfortable being in any sort of laboratory; their fears have superseded the appreciation for learning that takes place in the laboratory. They harbor an increasingly deep-seated dis-ease of "chemicals." They are constantly barraged with horror anecdotes like the one below (exactly how poisoned were the family members? hospitalized? etc.)

I cannot tell what institutional setting the original poster originates yet "DIY" seems a bit off the mark/scale/etc. In the laboratories I move we have proper ventilation, protective eye and other-ware, robust hazardous waste processes, ample hood space. Why shouldn't we attempt interesting chemical transformations and processes that engage, inspire, excite the next generations of chemical scientists? All of our wet chemical work is not at the level of even weak Piranha solutions yet we do bring out the conc acids once in a while so that they LEARN how to handle them rather than not. UGs need to learn how to navigate these spaces.

It comes as no surprise (to me, at least) that the energy of our nation has dissipated during my lifetime and has moved to other parts of the globe. It happens (and happened) a little at a time. While we have made very important and substantial improvements in chemical work (broadly defined) in our country (I witnessed hand rinsing with acetone and was told the "old guys" used benzene similarly, oh boy) we've also tamped down some spark.

It seems we're sort of scared and chemistry is emblematic of the fear. Too bad for us.

jadv

On Tue, 01 Feb 2022 7:19 AM, Alan Hall wrote:

There are 2 basic ways to recover gold (and silver and possibly other metals) used frequently from ore or other sources. One is the mercury amalgam method (and which in Colorado when the price of gold increased we had any number of folks who dug up old mine tailings, tried this process in basements -- usually under childrens' rooms --and got the whole family mercury poisoned.

The other method used by most mining companies involves cyanide salts and is nothin you'd want to DIY. See our recent book Hall, AH, Isom GE, Rockwood GA. Toxicology of Cyanides and Cyanogens: Experimental, Applied. and Clinical Aspects. Wiley Blackwell, 2015 for everything you never want to know about cyanide poisoning.

Even in Texas where I live in my semi-retirement, there's a place that recycles such equipment and I sent all my old computers down there for proper handling. I'd suggest the same to you.

When I lived in Colorado many years ago, there were real estate firms trying to sell old gold and silver mining property. Right, buy yourself a Superfund site.

Alan H. Hall, M.D.
Medical Toxicologist

On Tue, Feb 1, 2022 at 5:48 AM Daniel Kuespert <000015c40c7f7b23-dmarc-request**At_Symbol_Here**lists.princeton.edu <mailto:000015c40c7f7b23-dmarc-request**At_Symbol_Here**lists.princeton.edu>> wrote:

Precious metal recovery is an industry (random Google hit:https://princeizant.com/precious-metal-recovery<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fprinceizant.com%2Fprecious-metal-recovery&data=04%7C01%7Cjoseph.diverdi%40COLOSTATE.EDU%7C785666bed2da4e1daf6008d9e58ea53f%7Cafb58802ff7a4bb1ab21367ff2ecfc8b%7C0%7C0%7C637793223106041178%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=UbN1cMTVuxVcIhTeI0t1oOzuJvRrmTI3kUsSXdBt%2BIQ%3D&reserved=0>). I'd recommend selling the scrap. There are a wide variety of companies that recover gold, Pt, Ir, etc. from scrap, most commonly from electronics and spent catalysts. There's gold in them thar' PC boards, so naturally, there are gold miners too. A lot of copper as well, incidentally.

I'd consider that a better choice than a DIY approach; no waste that you're responsible for, and you don't have to deal with what is essentially weak Piranha solution, which isn't something suitable for undergraduates to work with. If there's somebody nearby who does that industrially, perhaps you could wangle a plant tour for the educational benefit.

Regards,
Dan


-------------------------------------------------
Daniel Kuespert, PhD, CSP
Chair-elect, CHAS 2022
Associate, CCS, 2021-2022

11101 Wood Elves Way
Columbia, MD 21044-1003
410-992-9709 vox
443-980-0989 mobile
dkuespert**At_Symbol_Here**jhu.edu <mailto:dkuespert**At_Symbol_Here**jhu.edu> (work)
dkuespert**At_Symbol_Here**pm.me <mailto:dkuespert**At_Symbol_Here**pm.me> (personal)

Please use dkuespert**At_Symbol_Here**pm.me <mailto:dkuespert**At_Symbol_Here**pm.me> for ACS business;
I am decommissioning dankuespert**At_Symbol_Here**me.com <mailto:dankuespert**At_Symbol_Here**me.com> for priority email.

On Jan 31, 2022, at 12:44, Melissa Anderson <mwanderson08**At_Symbol_Here**GMAIL.COM <mailto:mwanderson08**At_Symbol_Here**GMAIL.COM>> wrote:

Hi All,

Just got the question below from a student and wanted to get some additional opinions on the best way to respond. My initial take is

1) This is unlikely to be profitable and would be difficult to execute on a larger scale. They're probably better off recycling the materials.
2) I'm not a big fan of generating hazardous waste just for the novelty of seeing if you can perform a cool reaction. I'm inclined to recommend against even suggesting they do this (supervised) at a small scale for the "educational" benefit. (For reference, this is an introductory chem student, not an upper-division student.)

Here's the question text:

"I work for a small business that sells precision measurement equipment. We recently purchased a portion of another company, and as part of that buyout we received literally tens of thousands of old obsolete computer parts and microchips and the like. They're not really worth anything now (except for being really cool, old electronics), so we're not really having much luck trying to resell them. Here's where the potentially fun part comes in.

A good portion of these parts are coated in gold. I've done a bit of research online, and it looks like there's a process to chemically separate the gold from the rest of the components. The internet is, as usual, a bit contradictory on what process is the best way to go about it. Different sites profess their way is best, and I'm obviously green when it comes to chemistry, so I was wondering what your thoughts were?

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/extract-gold-from-electronics <https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.wired.co.uk%2Farticle%2Fextract-gold-from-electronics&data=04%7C01%7Cjoseph.diverdi%40COLOSTATE.EDU%7C785666bed2da4e1daf6008d9e58ea53f%7Cafb58802ff7a4bb1ab21367ff2ecfc8b%7C0%7C0%7C637793223106041178%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=rOlFldAXLD9MQVzRCFz5xQqbU%2BczAT4QJ3rYXQeDI4U%3D&reserved=0>

Here's an article I found after a brief google search kind of outlining a process. I was hoping to give this a shot on a small scale and then maybe attempt something larger if I'm successful. But I need to know... Will following this article get me killed or result in a visit from the FBI??? I think it would be a fun, cool way to do a bit of chemistry and make the business I work for a bit of extra money off of some items that would otherwise just be thrown away, but I obviously want to do it in a safe, proper way

Any advice or insight you have would be greatly appreciated"

--
Joseph A. DiVerdi, Ph.D., M.B.A.
Associate Professor of Chemistry
Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO, USA
+1.970.980.5868 - /diverdi.colostate.edu/
/us02web.zoom.us/j/9460709393

---
For more information about the DCHAS-L e-mail list, contact the Divisional membership chair at membership**At_Symbol_Here**dchas.org
Follow us on Twitter **At_Symbol_Here**acsdchas