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Subject: [DCHAS-L] Request for the community guidance and input

Date: Jun 24, 2019 15:09 UTC

Author: Gmurczyk, Marta <M_Gmurczyk**At_Symbol_Here**acs.org>

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Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] [EXT] Re: [DCHAS-L] Letter to the National PTA regarding the rainbow flame demo

Date: Jun 24, 2019 17:39 UTC

Author: Monona Rossol <0000030664c37427-dmarc-request**At_Symbol_Here**LISTS.PRINCETON.EDU>

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From: Ken Kretchman <kwkretch**At_Symbol_Here**ncsu.edu>

Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] Subject: [DCHAS-L] Letter to the National PTA regardingthe rainbow flamedemo

Date: Jun 24, 2019 15:27 UTC

Reply-To: ACS Division of Chemical Health and Safety

In-Reply-To: Re: [DCHAS-L] Subject: [DCHAS-L] Letter to the National PTA regardingthe rainbow flamedemo

Demystify: 

Well said Kirk..

There is at least one more aspect to this that I think is worth airing....Taking nothing away from what has been shared but concerned
that we will still see more of these...

On the receiving side of these demos or the unfortunate person in the bar who was engulfed in flame is, I think, a basic and unfounded
assumption that the person initiating the event would not put someone else in harms way..so it must be safe. I think parents need to
teach their children to trust their instincts and common sense and exercise caution (hard to do that with a elementary schooler) and whenever
unsure....to question. and adjust. It may result in a few more steps further away from the flame.. This because despite everyone's best efforts at awareness
and proper procedure, not everyone will get the message.

Easier said than done but important I think.

Ken Kretchman .


Ken Kretchman, CIH, CSP Director, Environmental Health and Safety
NC State University / Box 8007 / 2620 Wolf Village Way / Raleigh North Carolina 27695-8007
Email: Ken_Kretchman**At_Symbol_Here**ncsu.edu / Phone: (919).515.6860 / Fax: (919).515.6307


On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 8:59 AM Kirk Hunter <kirk.p.hunter**At_Symbol_Here**gmail.com> wrote:

Hi All,

Here's my "flame" story. I did many outreach activities that include various demos that used combustibles =E2=80" flaming water, alcohol link rel="canonical" href="https://www.ilpi.com, whoosh bottle, flame test, etc. up until the mid-90s. I always told the audience to never try to replicate these demos because they didn't know the needed precautions. I also tried to make any apparatus look more complicated that it needed to be to discourage replication.

Well, after doing demos for a combined group of jr high and senior high students, I got a call a couple days later from one of the teachers. A couple the students tried to replicate one of the flame demos I did. They ended up getting severely burned and hospitalized. My activities were reviewed looking for evidence by lawyers that I had provided information on how to do the activity. No luck there, so the parents were left with a huge medical bill.

At that point I quit doing any flame/combustion demos. Every thing I did used water. It was just as engaging. I could have fun with the students and they learned many of exact same concepts I was trying to do with flames.

I will also add my voice that if you must flames and explosions to engage students, then you really don't know how to teach. (My tongue-in-cheek editorial but a level of honest seriousness!) Demos can be fun and safe and not put anyone in harms way.

My only caveat is that the janitors didn't like me because I tended to splash water around. So, I just brought my own tarp and clean-up kit. Problem solved.

(Oh, I=E2=80™ve got more horror stories!! But that's for later.)

Kirk Hunter

214-693-8179

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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