Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2006 20:55:31 -0500
Reply-To: Georjean Adams <gla**At_Symbol_Here**EHSSTRATEGIES.COM>
Sender: DCHAS-L Discussion List <DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**LIST.UVM.EDU>
From: Georjean Adams <gla**At_Symbol_Here**EHSSTRATEGIES.COM>
Subject: Re: Respirators on High School Kids
Comments: To: "Wood-Black, Frankie K"
In-Reply-To: <8E292B0BB313C64BAC33708224515E5E05D5F93A**At_Symbol_Here**>

I really didn't mean to unleash such a firestorm!

I agree, the equipment and training to properly use PPE are not likely to be
available in a high school.   That was kind of my point - you need to do
risk assessment before you do experiments and make sure you can safely
manage risks from beginning to end.  (College labs should, however.  I
cringe to remember the dumb stuff - like mouth pipetting - we did in my
day!  And when's the last time the hoods were checked?)

What would be valuable at any age group is to discuss PPE and how chemicals
need to be handled responsibly.  I think it would be great to have a CIH
come in and talk about how chemicals are handled safely in the workplace.
Maybe let the kids try on some respirators and gloves and talk about just
the issues you all have been raising.

Again, I hope  you aren't teaching kids to fear chemicals or to consider
them EVIL - except for some  magical "green" chemicals.  Remember,
everychemical has risk at some level of exposure.  Teach the concepts
of risk 
exposure (dose) + hazard and the benefits gained from chemicals that are
properly managed and the costs of failure to manage them.  And don't bore
them to death with experiments that can only be done with water and table
salt (as long as they don't drink to much of it!),

We need kids who want to be chemists!


On 10/5/06, Wood-Black, Frankie K 
> I haven't joined in the discussion but I do think two points need to be
> made.
> First - I concur whole heartedly that general experiments in high school
> or college - should be developed using green chemistry techniques.  You
> can substitute many different experiments that teach the concepts with
> out having to resort to materials that MUST use PPE.
> HOWEVER - I do think it is an excellent idea to have them use PPE even
> though PPE is not necessarily a requirement as it teaches good
> laboratory practice.
> Frankie Wood-Black
> Cell 580-761-3703
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DCHAS-L Discussion List [mailto:DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**] On Behalf Of
> Gordon Miller
> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 9:44 AM
> To: DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**
> Subject: [DCHAS-L] Respirators on High School Kids
> Say what?????!!
> Respirators don't belong on underage kids. Change the experimental
> design. I'm sure any number of attorneys will be happy to instruct
> the school about this in a court of law, preferably with the help of
> a jury to boost their take.
> What I wrote earlier about respirators applies to college students
> and, maybe, faculty.

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