From: Monona Rossol <0000030664c37427-dmarc-request**At_Symbol_Here**LISTS.PRINCETON.EDU>
Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] liability and an impossible CHP
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 00:30:26 +0000
Reply-To: ACS Division of Chemical Health and Safety <DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**PRINCETON.EDU>
Message-ID: 1453266047.2199597.1573345826584**At_Symbol_Here**

I have great respect for your opinions having known you for so long.  I only do a two hour presentation at the first planning meeting where I try to get them to understand the hazards of the materials and the need for all of the special ventilation and features we will design.  

Then I write the massive IH reports that go department by department laying out the safety and ventilation equipment and special features required for the materials and processes they say they want to do and use.  These reports are always 150 page or more.  That's where I'll have to be very clear about the issues and what they should be doing even though I know they won't.


-----Original Message-----
From: Carlos Rentas Jr <000007045322fca5-dmarc-request**At_Symbol_Here**LISTS.PRINCETON.EDU>
Sent: Sat, Nov 9, 2019 6:18 pm
Subject: [DCHAS-L] liability and an impossible CHP

=EF=BB=BF Monona, greetings my friend.  In a case like the one you describe, your obligation would be to write your observations and your interpretation of the requirements under the law; advise and counsel. As an expert in your field, you can't become a party to a liability lawsuit. I would guess that part of your contract is to conduct an inspection or evaluation of the facility and their programs before you present your training program. But even if you don't conduct an inspection, the fact that you reviewed their program documentation and found it to be deficient or lacking in many areas is sufficient for you to include these findings in your your "due diligence," you can't go wrong with that; follow your conscience. That's how I would approach it. Hope this is helpful, but this is just my approach and others may have different approaches and opinions.

My very best to you and yours. Your forever friend,


Dr. Carlos Rentas Jr., DPH-ME, MSPH, MA, CSP, CHMM-Emeritus
Doctor of Public Health in Medical Epidemiology
and Emerging Infectious Diseases, Principal Investigator and Consultant in Mycotoxins, Microbial Investigations and Airborne Contaminants, Applied Root-Cause and Risk-Based Incident Analysis
Pipers Glen Estates-Westchester Country Club
6221 Golf Villas Dr., Boynton Beach, FL 33437
Bus: (718) 813-1883
EMail: Carlos.Rentas**At_Symbol_Here**
Other: crentas1**At_Symbol_Here**

On Nov 9, 2019, at 4:38 PM, DCHAS Membership Chair <membership**At_Symbol_Here**> wrote:

=EF=BB=BFFrom: Monona Rossol <actsnyc**At_Symbol_Here**>
Re: liability and an impossible CHP

Oh shoot.  I have a problem again.  Maybe some advice from you guys would help.

I have an art building planning job in one of those states in which OSHA does not cover the state schools. I went on the university's website and read all their EH&S stuff - which you can do in 40 minutes, since there is so little.  They only have a Chemical Hygiene Plan and nothing at all for the art department.

The school has turned over safety to the individual professors in the mistaken belief that this takes the administration off the hook.  That's what UCLA thought also until their Board of Regents was indicted for criminally negligent homicide.  

That CHP is written so badly, it would be impossible even for trained chemists to comply, so my bet is nobody does anything.  For example, the professors have the job of obtaining the SDSs and putting them in the binders.  There is no inventory.  And if they store or use mixtures of chemicals, the CHP requires the professor to write their own SDSs to cover the hazards of the mixture.  I wouldn't even try that.

For another example, EH&S only has to supply the professors with containers for waste.  It is the professors' job to determine which wastes require collection, write the EPA label, supervise waste collection, and call for a pick up. That takes knowledge of the EPA and local waste rules.  So my guess it's just "Oops" and down the drain.

And the art department plans are calling for dozens of individual studios called "research studios" where they apparently can use any chemical or art material or equipment they take it into their heads to use and they have 24 hour access to these studios.

When I do my presentation for the art faculty I will try to make these points and the need for ventilation and limits on  materials, but I don't have any real hope of making a dent after what I've seen and read.  

I will write this report VERY carefully.  There is a fine line between trying to do a good job for a client and, instead, aiding and abetting them. And I'm not sure where the "due diligence" and "failure to warn" boundaries are here   But I need to try to find them.  Any and all advice is welcome.


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